r/PoursTea • u/Timbucktwo1230 šŸ«– Mod ā˜•ļø • 13h ago

FeministTeašŸ‘©šŸ»ā€šŸŽ“šŸ‘©šŸæā€āš–ļøšŸ‘ šŸ„¾ Regrets And Perspectives

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26

u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 10h ago

OK, but what the wife said is still incredibly toxic and I cannot fathom why this sub is so reluctant to call that out. It's literally blatant. She didn't sacrifice for her husband, she sacrificed for herself and her family.

1

u/Separate-Taste3513 9h ago

But she sacrificed. What did her husband sacrifice? Did her labor allow him to pursue his career without focusing equal attention and energy to his home and children?

It's toxic because it's hurtful, right? She was hurt by those circumstances and lost opportunities while he was allowed to pursue his goals. What did he do to help her achieve HER goals?

9

u/Free-Mongoose-1983 9h ago

Maybe she should have communicated with her husband and stopped having more kids or not had kids at all. Abortions and birth control exist. This was completely avoidable but she chose to not say anything and harbor resentment for something he didn't intend to do for 20 years.

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u/Separate-Taste3513 8h ago

Are abortion and birth control options for everyone at every time?

From this post, we know that abortion was not considered a viable option because the choice made by both of them was to "postpone" her educational goals.

They absolutely should have communicated better and more openly. They should have planned better before and after that particular pregnancy. Lots of shoulds, woulds, and coulds. The result, however, is a woman who was not helped in the pursuit of her own personal fulfillment and a man who never even considered she needed any help.

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u/Frylock_dontDM 8h ago

Kids go to school.

You have about 7hrs uninterrupted a day after the kids turn about 5-6yrs old to be able to attend school.

This is not a hard situation to overcome in the least.

The AI that wrote this forgot to include a reason she couldn't study in her mid twenties when the kids went to school.

Speaking as someone who went back to school and got a second degree in my mid twenties, 3 classes at a time isn't a huge deal, and it's college, no one cares that much if you miss a class or 3, as long as you get the work done

5

u/Free-Mongoose-1983 8h ago edited 8h ago

Even if abortion wasn't available for the first. They continued to have kids. Birth control exists, condoms are extremely cheap and accessible, they should've used them. They should've used it for the first child as well. Family planning is done by intelligent people.

Ultimately this is the fault of the woman for not communicating and expecting her husband to read her mind. Why is she wasting time giving him "hints" instead of being direct. But ultimately it doesn't matter because the post is fake and written by a bot

3

u/throwawayshmoaway411 6h ago

Well, seeing as Roe v Wade has only been overturned for like a year, and this couple has been married for 20 years, yes, abortion and birth control were both options available to them.

8

u/HaYuFlyDisTang 9h ago

He sacrificed spending time with his family to support his family financially.

She sacrificed supporting her family financially to spend time with her family.

Both sacrificed something, and both provided for their family.

One apparently resents the deal and values a missed opportunity at a career more than spending time with the family they chose to have and also having a partner willing to sacrifice time with their family to make it all possible financially.

Family is everything. Work is a means to that end.

-2

u/Separate-Taste3513 8h ago

So, he didn't get time with his family after work? He didn't make time for his family on the weekends? No, he didn't sacrifice time with his family in a manner equivalent to "postponing" continued education indefinitely.

Work is a necessity. Money is a necessity. Someone will have to work to support a family. That's an inescapable truth.

The problem is that he made no effort to ensure that she was able to pursue her own personal fulfillment, which he obviously derived from his career.

When you make one person sacrifice personal fulfillment for the sake of the family without ever extending any effort to help them pursue it while simultaneously benefiting from that sacrifice by pursuing your own goals, you don't get to claim you lost time with them as a sacrifice.

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u/01zorro1 8h ago

i would rather postpone my education indefinitely than to work a fisical job while my whole family depends on only my money to survive, you cant imagine the ammount of stress and pain it can cause you, you cant be with your family, you talk with your boss, with your coworkers more than with your own children because you have to work 50+hours per week, its exausting and heartbreaking

-1

u/Separate-Taste3513 8h ago

So is staying home so your spouse can work.

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u/01zorro1 8h ago

yes, you get it, both sacrificed and both suffered, you do understand it!

-2

u/Separate-Taste3513 8h ago

Except one gets to derive personal satisfaction, prestige, social status, and a variety of benefits from working while Mom is just doing her duty for her family.

Oh, and probably doing it wrong, somehow. The house isn't clean enough, or too clean. The meals aren't good enough. She's too controlling or permissive.

5

u/confirmedshill123 7h ago

Dude if I could drop my career entirely and stay home with my kid I would do so in an instant.

Just because I have a career doesn't mean I'm happy about it or wouldn't rather just be with my kid, but it's a sacrifice I have to make to make enough money to live.

Also this shit is fake as fuck.

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u/01zorro1 8h ago

"Except one gets to derive personal satisfaction, prestige" what personal satisfaction? unless he is a workoholinc that doesnt love his family, i would rather be with my children and wife than with my asshole coworkers
and again, we go arround and arround, i listed a lot of points on why working is not the magic land of the fun in my first coment
is that hard for you to understand that both sides sacrificed, and both sides have it hard? really?

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u/gobby94 5h ago

Donā€™t worry, this womanā€™s unhinged. Sleep well knowing she probably wonā€™t.

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u/gobby94 8h ago

You should talk to someoneā€¦

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u/Separate-Taste3513 8h ago

Maybe you should. Like, your mom. Or your grandma. Or your aunt. Or any of the women in the generation before you.

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u/gobby94 8h ago

I have! My grandma had a fantastic career. She had to retire early because of heart problems. But even on her deathbed she said she never felt she sacrificed or missed out on anything in her life, with the exception of her health (diet related).
My mom, not so much - but nothing to do with giving anything up for children.
You should try talking to any human being, but I challenge you to do it in person :-) good luck, think youā€™ll need it!

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u/Magnon 7h ago

At least based on the context we have here she was never forbidden from pursuing nursing or what ever, she never brought up that she'd like to return to it. How would he know going back to nursing was still a significant goal for her if she never talked about it?

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u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 7h ago

No one is disputing that being a stay at home mom has downstream effects, don't deflect the conversation. She is blaming the husband for JOINT decisions that she took part in.

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u/Specific_Box4483 6h ago

I don't know about this AI family's situation, but for most men, working long hours isn't a dream life either. Perhaps he would have enjoyed life a bit more if he had to spent less time at work, and more time with the children, and she would have done the same.

As for "what did he do to help her achieve HER goals", it's not his fault she didn't explain what her goals actually were. She was acting against her own goals by withholding communication, and possibly having more children than was feasible for her own goals. And now she blames her husband.

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u/AnonymousTHX-1138 5h ago

Why do people like you depict "a career" as some amazing wonderful benefit, instead of the burdensome responsibility it is? The blatant mischaracterization of a man's life so that you can character assassinate him is just despicable.

-2

u/Dddddd92 10h ago

You might think it's toxic. I think she was just being honest.

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u/hiles_adam 10h ago

Honesty and toxicity arenā€™t mutually exclusive.

That might be how she feels, but she should have brought these feelings up to her partner not her child.

ā€œDonā€™t throw your life away for a man like I did for your fatherā€. The bolder bit is completely unnecessary to make the point and it literally just inserting your issues and trauma dumping them onto your kid.

-1

u/Dddddd92 10h ago

Again, she was just being honest about her feelings. If you cannot be honest about your family what's the point of a family.

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u/Neat-Box-7761 10h ago

Iā€™m sorry but being in a family/relationship does not mean you always tell the brutal truth. Thatā€™s complete BS.

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u/Material-Command-854 9h ago

But Iā€™ve been down the road youā€™re suggesting. The person in question always nitpicks your tone, your timing, your choice of words, your communication skills, anything to turn the criticism on the other person. There is no way to tell someone a truth they donā€™t want to hear.

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u/Neat-Box-7761 8h ago

Yes there is, you have to be a good communicator. Telling the truth all the time is not the same thing as being a good communicator. Iā€™ve been with my wife for 10+ years and we have an amazing relationship. I absolutely do not always tell her the brutal honest truth.

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u/Material-Command-854 8h ago

Only if you can trust the other person to engage with you in good faith. In a romantic relationship itā€™s often different I suppose. In friendships or in the workplace, people have no incentive to hear you out if it means being uncomfortable.

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u/Neat-Box-7761 8h ago

Well I hope if you are married or in a relationship with someone then you can trust they are acting in good faith. If you canā€™t then what the heck are you doing.

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u/Dddddd92 10h ago

Oh OK, you play pretence for years?? With the people you are supposed to be honest and truthful with? The people who you are supposed to trust and confide in??

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u/HaYuFlyDisTang 9h ago

Theres a way to say "i wonder what would have been possible had i pursued the career i could have had" without saying "you robbed me of my dreams of working and it was a mistake to spend time with my family instead of working"

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u/Dddddd92 9h ago

Again, she is being honest with her daughter.

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u/HaYuFlyDisTang 6h ago

Again, there's a better way to express that feeling than telling your child you resent them and their father

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u/[deleted] 6h ago

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u/hiles_adam 10h ago

Sheā€™s being honest about her feelings to the wrong person.

Telling your child that them being born and their father ruined a hypothetical version of her life is incredibly toxic, it solves nothing.

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u/Dddddd92 10h ago

Not at all. The child needs to know to make better choices.

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u/hiles_adam 9h ago

And there is a way to tell your child to make better decisions than you did, without blaming your joint decisions solely on the father or telling the child they are the reason your life sucks.

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u/Dddddd92 9h ago

Hoe the hell is she only blaming the dad??? She is literally telling the child, pick better than what I picked!!!!

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u/hiles_adam 9h ago

They literally included the exact quote

ā€œNever give up your future for a man the way I did for your fatherā€

Itā€™s not ā€œdonā€™t give up your future for a manā€, its not ā€œfollow your dreams not a manā€

Itā€™s I resent your father and you because I gave up a hypothetically better life.

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u/HaYuFlyDisTang 9h ago

Not even a better life, just one where they work instead of their partner.

The grass is always greener on the other side. Personally id always prefer the side where i see my children as much as possible.

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u/Dddddd92 9h ago

Yeah and? She is exactly telling her daughter "don't pick a man over your dreams like I did, I still regret it".....

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u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 10h ago

If you call "I resent your father because our joint decisions that I never tried to change are his fault and family life ruined my trajectory" just "honesty", you should never have kids.

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u/Dddddd92 10h ago

I agree she shouldn't have had kids. But she did. And she can be honest about it so the daughter chooses better.

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u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 10h ago

Stop being obtuse. SHE IS BAD MOUTHING THE DAD TO THE KIDS FOR DECISIONS SHE PARTICIPATED IN MAKING.

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u/Dddddd92 9h ago

She just said "I made a shit choice which I regret, you do better"

Stop being emotional.

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u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 9h ago

No, she did not. Stop excusing toxicity.

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u/Dddddd92 9h ago

She literally did just that lol. Stop being emotional about a made up reddit post.

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u/WaffleHouseFistFight 10h ago

Itā€™s toxic and itā€™s the kind of thing only a toxic person would think is ok.

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u/Salt-Lingonberry-853 10h ago

She is being both. Those feelings should be expressed to the husband or a counselor in private (who can hopefully help her realize how irrational her placement of blame is) and the advice should be expressed to the kids. That she chose to outright blame her husband while tacitly admitting she regrets having her family in front of the kids is incredibly toxic. I'm not saying it's divorce worthy on its own, but holy hell that kind of thing would have me considering my options.