I'm just still surprised by that Pelicot case in France. How was he able to find dozens of men to do that, for years, without someone asking questions, tipping someone off, or just thinking, "Wait a minute...?"
Not just finding dozens of men: all of them were inside a frighteningly small geographical radius from them. Like, you'd think that this was about setting up some shit that required looking all over the country, potentially other countries, but it was all local. That's the most fucked up bit.
The thing is: as a woman, I didn't find it unexpected. At all.
What really surprised me with that case, was the men's reaction to it.
I expected the ones in denial ("she must have known", "it's impossible she never felt something was wrong", etc.), the ones dismissing ("yeah, it's just some bad apples, but what's really bad is those generalising about men because of it"), the ones trying to say it's not men just like them who are the problems ("these are not men, these are monsters", or the "it's immigrants once again" - nope, too bad for the far right, a majority were white French men). These are the usual reactions to the horrors women encounter, so no surprise here.
No, what was really surprising was the sheer amount of men finding it surprising. Like, are we even living in the same world??? Rapists are everywhere, and can be just about anyone, and there are more than just a few. Women have been saying it since decades at least.
It only showed me once more how little men listen to women, or if they did how little credit they give to what they say.
Exactly. I can go online and pull up a list of registered sex offenders in my area, knowing that those are only the ones who actually got caught and punished.
How could anyone be surprised is beyond me.
And yet, first responses to my message and below are "but me I'm such a good man that other men don't dare be sexist before me".
When I don't even talk about men reacting to other men's behaviour, only about men not listening and believing the numerous women who say it's anyone anywhere (or rather everywhere given the amount).
When it's not "but women never told me, how was I supposed to know?". Yeah sure. It's not like it's a secret whispered between girls.
Talk about tone deaf. You talk to them about listening to women and they answer "but such men don't talk to us like that".
That's fucked up part of the fucked up part, we aren't. If you're one of the "regular men", creeps don't talk to you about their creep activities, and women don't tell you because you might also be one of the creeps, and there is no way to tell you aren't. For most of my life I as a man, lived in the world where I was absolutely completely sure that rapists are that weird separate group of people who are just completely bad, and you also need to be completely bad to even know one. The idea that your collegue, who is perfectly pleasant in a breakroom and tells funny stories on corporate cookouts, can abuse his wife of 12 years is fucking alien, because this just never happens.
I didn't have to call out weird behavior of my peers for decades. It might be because I surrounded myself with decent people. It might also be because creeps mask around me because I'm a known liberal soyboy and I don't know how to tell the difference.
Yeah I feel like shit dudes signal their shittiness to other dudes and clock when they don't laugh or nod in solidarity. Abusive people want to look good, it makes them feel better. So they gotta test if they're in a safe space to get fully disgusting. And they don't wanna feel shame, because they rationalize it that ALL men are just like that, when it's not true. So the actually decent guys are baffled and the shit guys assume everyone is deep down as gross as they are
I mean pretty much. Im surprised women are surprised we are surprised. We dont know becsuse no one tells us. No one tells me they raped their wife or children. Why would they? I have dealt with weirdos. I know they exist because I have dealt with one. He tried getting me involved with his weird shit.
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u/eur26 3d ago
I'm just still surprised by that Pelicot case in France. How was he able to find dozens of men to do that, for years, without someone asking questions, tipping someone off, or just thinking, "Wait a minute...?"