Paint a fair picture even if it is bleak. Say the truth. Mention that these situations are hard to navigate and can be socially costly. That victims might defend their abusers and they could stay with them for years after your intervention attempt. That the abuser will try and alienate any allies you might have had and the abusers social position might make it likely that they will favor them instead of you. Say that most women struggle with these realities just like men do and fail to stand up for their principles as well. That one also needs to be critical of the accuser because they might want to use the group to control their victim. These situation can be hard to navigate so try and get someone you trust outside that social group so you can evaluate it better.
Not a clue. It just feels like progress isn’t happening like it should, and this oversimplification seems to be alienating a lot of people, compounding the issue instead of solving it.
It’s just a personal observation, I wish I had a better solution.
Men don’t pay attention until they’re able to take personal offense. It’s been a topic for over a century. The All Men phrasing has been around a decade. Most men here didn’t know that.
Until they found a way to be personally hurt, clutch pearls and gasp HOW DARE YOU INCLUDE ME (in the topic of systemic violence against women and girls)!!! They simply ignored it.
When was the last time you paid attention to the topic?
When was the last time you took offense at the phrasing? (Like your comment I’m responding to)
When was the last time you took any action to being part of the solution, instead of part of the problem?
Men will not pay attention until they take it personally. The ONLY reason they are currently taking it personally is because of this phrasing they initially think lumps them in with violent offenders. Or, they’ve had women or girls they care about be personally impacted and they are brought in that way.
I disagree, only because I’m kinda old. I’ve never before seen as much attention on this topic. It’s been a topic forever, since way before I was born. Verrrrrry rarely did men help or join in on this topic.
Now that men found a way to take it personally offensive, it matters to them. SOME of them stay with the topic long enough to connect the dots. Like the guy in the video talking about it. There’s so many more platforming this than ever in my lifetime. I’ve never seen so many men being allies to women and speaking up on behalf of women and girls.
Yes, the violence has grown. But the violence was growing already, and men were silent.
Now it’s shifting, compared to before, and more and more are seeing the important role they play in all of this. More are grasping that it has to be them. They have to lead it, not just call them leaders, but actually do something. And more are, even when it’s not enough yet!
I’m a grandma who is fully invested. My favorite person is my granddaughter. This is personal to me. I’m hopeful. We NEVER had this growing up, nothing close to it. I know it’s still very grim. But with more women speaking up than ever before, it’s educating the younger ones.
With more men joining, other men will listen. It’s the sad reality that men listen more to other men. But, since that’s the way it is, we need more of it.
In today’s world, most men need it to personally affect them before it’ll click. They’re first offended at the phrasing, then some are intelligent enough to stick around and fully grasp it. Then, more of those are then taking action.
Keep up the fight, because giving up means helping the offenders, not the victims! There’s nothing the offenders want more than silence and protection. Everyone giving up is their Utopia!
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u/YiddoMonty 3d ago
The over simplification of this issue seems to be doing more harm than good. It feels like we need to change the approach a little.